The following are the outputs of the captioning taken during an IGF intervention. Although it is largely accurate, in some cases it may be incomplete or inaccurate due to inaudible passages or transcription errors. It is posted as an aid, but should not be treated as an authoritative record.
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>> Good morning. Could you try to switch on your cameras and unmute?
Or give us a sign if that's not possible. Thank you.
>> NNENNNA IFEANYI-AJUFO: Hi good morning. Can you hear me?
>> Yes, perfect.
We will give you a sign and start in a few minutes, we're just
waiting for the rest of the speakers.
>> Good evening everyone. Just checking in the room. Are we ready
to start?
Okay. We just waiting for one more panelist, then.
>> FABIOLA FRICK: We will wait two more minutes and then we start.
If that's okay for everyone.
Towela, I think we can start.
>> TOWELA NYIRENDA-JERE: Good morning, good afternoon. This is the
IGF 23 Open Forum. Appropriately titled Whose Internet?: Towards a
Feminist Digital Future for Africa. My name is Towela, I work with the
African Union development agency in Johannesburg, South Africa and lead
the economic division team and it is my singular honour and pleasure
really to host this session, to moderate. And actually cohort with my
colleague Alice who's sitting in the room. I'm really happy to have
both the panelists that are physically in Kyoto, in terms of the
context of the discussion that we will have today there's been a number
of exciting developments from the African Union site in terms of the
digital transformation strategy, which the commission has been working
on in terms of unpacking that into a number of different policy
frameworks and strategies for implementation. Including very
deliberate strategies related to data policy, the data governance,
looking at ideas of issues of digital id, the transformation process of
digitalization as it applies to different asectors across the
continent, whether in agriculture, health or education. And really
trying to see how to appropriately position is ICTs and digitalization
at the centre of Africa's economic transformation.
I think attendant with that of course will always be the discussions
around gender inclusiveness and how we really ensure that all these
different frameworks, strategies, adequately take cognizance of the
important aspect of gender and particularly the issues around
inclusiveness when it comes to making sure that these policies and
frameworks respond to the needs of women, that they actually are
inclusive in terms of adequately positioning women not only in the
definition of the strategies, but also in their implementation and in
the benefits thereof. So this discussion is meant to let us delve into
issues. We've got a very stellar panel in front of me that will be
really looking at this issue and trying to unpack for us from their
experiences what have they experienced in terms of gender
inclusiveness, what have they done in terms of the work that they do in
terms of promoting gender inclusiveness but also the challenges that
they have faced. We'll look at some of the barriers that perhaps we
need to address as we look at the gender transformative nature of
digitalization and then we will also look at some of the opportunities.
Ultimately at the end of the day we want to be able to have
recommendations for ourselves as women, recommendations for our
policy-makers, recommendations for our partners. And really
recommendations that will ensure that for African women indeed the
future is digital and it's a digital future that takes cognizance of
their role. Both on the supply side and on the demand side and in
terms of also on the benefits as well.
So that leads us to introduce my panel very briefly. And I'm sure as
they also make their interventions they will also perhaps supplement my
very brief introduction with some additional information about the work
that they have done. So in no particular order, we have Alice Munyua ,
the senior director for Africa working on a project called Reddit, and
she has decades of experience working with multiple stakeholders on the
continent with different issues, including being the founder and -- of
the tech Internet and I'm sure will tell us more about that in terms of
her establishing that particular organisation.
We Bonnita Nyamwire joining us online at policy Uganda, data,
technology and design, we have Dr. Nnenna Ifeanyi-Ajufo, board member
of the African women's cyber security and professor of technology law.
We have Ganna Ayman, for the Internet governance forum, for students at
the University. We have Liz -- and she basically in Kenya has worked
in other capacities carrying out national cyber security assessments.
Last but not least we are joined by the only male on the panel, who
will give us the male perspective but also the partner perspective with
this, Tobias tele, and we're pleased that he's able to join us for this
presentation. With that, let's get into it. We will of course have a
few rounds of questions and then specifically to the different partner,
to the different panelists. But we're also very much welcoming our
online participants to also I think make use of the chat functions in
terms of your Q&As and then also in terms of the people that are in the
room. Also please hold your questions so we can take them when we do
the Q&A session to acknowledge the fact that Alice has generously
agreed to support and co-moderate the session with me. She will be
helping us with the Q&A part of the session.
So Alice I'm going to start with you.
And really just looking at the different experiences that are in the
room and among the panelists. And how we have all traversed the
journey. I think you've been working in digital policy making for a
long time. You helped establish the Kenya ICT action network, kick
Internet. Done a lot of consulting including for the African Union and
now working for Mozilla as a director.
So maybe share with us what has been your experience in terms of
paving the way I think for so many young African women who have gone on
this journey and hoping to follow in your footsteps. Alice.
>> ALICE MUNYUA: Okay. Thank you very much Towela and thank you
very much for inviting me to be on this panel and to co-moderate with
you Towela, you have met me, aged me, I'm actually quite old in this
space.
Things started when we used to call this communication for
development. Or even before communication for development we used to
call it social communications.
So yes, you know, and yes my past year was actually being able to
look at the Internet, the impact the new so-called Internet was having
on society when I was then working for the Vatican, the Vatican radio
and we were creating the Vatican II council. God yes, I'm old. And we
were the first ones to actually begin to interrogate what this
so-called new technology was about and what impact it would have.
In society generally. So -- and yes, I was actually the second or
third cohort of women to be allowed to attend the prestigious Pontific
University at the Vatican and also as a programme assistant for the
African service of the Vatican radio. So my background in
communication is quite, you know, varied. And my first laptop was one
of those things that needed a whole wheel bare row to carry when I
lived in Rome. So it's quite a long journey. And by then, you know we
were looking at radio. And then from then the Internet. And then I
was involved with the -- what -- the information society and there
really acknowledging that there was a huge gender gap that women were
not involved in the discussion, the discourse and evening the building
of this new technology, the Internet. So that's how far I come.
And I would find myself in these spaces as the only woman. And for
those who know how that can be, I don't want -- I mean, I think I am
going to use the word "violent" it can be really a violent space, to be
the only woman and the only Black woman in these spaces.
But then we did it. And also then coming home to Kenya, where the
Kenyan government had declared the Internet illegal and having to fight
that. That whole process.
Our government actually did not want the Internet introduced in our
country because there was this perception that it was taking away from
the posts in telecommunication, what we used to call telecom Kenya.
Lonely journey in that we didn't -- nobody understood this technology.
The government policy-makers did not understand this technology. Did
not understand how you know, the -- how it could contribute or what
value it was bringing to its own national development framework or the
way they thought about the development framework.
So it's through that and through joining together with -- I actually
started working my first job was with the association for progressive
communications, with Andrea here, running as their programme officer
for communications, running huge project called catalyzing access to
ICTs in Africa that was funded by the U.K. government, the Fand D it
was there that I created the Kenyan action network. The reason why I
created the Kenyan ICT network was because a lot of people on one end
you had government that did not understand the Internet. Then you have
the private sector that understood the potential of the Internet.
And those -- so civil society that also understood the potential for
the Internet in democratizing communication. And we were all fighting
each other. You know, pulling each other.
And so I took on the responsibility to try and bring us together and
those who are Kenyans know that around this period 'til today -- and
it's not just Kenya actually, it's globally. When you're fighting for
any right, there's -- it's very easy to be branded, you know, terrible
names. There's an African saying that when a hyena wants to eat its
cubs it first accuses them of smelling of goats. And so we were
accused of being activists. And because once you called an activist in
Kenya -- I don't know about other countries -- it means that
policy-makers are not going to listen to you. Neither is the private
sector. Actually neither is the media unless they're really courageous
to put down and to expose what we are trying to advocate for.
So luckily for us there was a huge policy window, with a new
government came in, the Kibaki government in 2000. And thief there was
a policy window. At that point the minister of information
communication was created. And two of my really good friends Tugu and
Auba Rega as was appointed at the secretary. But then they made the
mistake of disbanding the communications commission. The regulatory
body. The board. And by then I had left the APC, and was fully
committed to just convening and ensuring that the kick --er net was
running and fight to have an ICT policy framework that would allow
especially the private sector and civil society to then do work in the
country.
And guess what? Kibaki then appointed me to be a commissioner on the
regulatory authority for six years there. And serving with the various
ministers, it was fast -- fast and second and third. We managed to
bring in the fiber optic cable, managed to create competition,
signed -- I'm -- I'm the one who was the chair of the technical
committee of the communications commission of Kenya. Then it used to
be called the CC K, now it's called the communication authority.
Including signing the papers for what we -- the famous mobile money
M-PESA, the most famous mobile money payment platform actually in the
world. And even kicker net is actually the only network of that
nature. Although currently it's completely different. Government no
longer actively contributes, it's become a think tank which is
brilliant because we have not anticipated and really actually affirmed
to this, we continue to do a lot of monitoring and evaluation. And
we're very clear we didn't expect the kicker net to survive beyond the
creation of the ICT policy. That it survived beyond that is a huge
legacy and I'm very proud of what it is. It was actually quite
difficult doing that as a woman. It was lonely. I was the only woman.
But I was very, very fortunate to be supported by really strong -- a
very strong team of men.
And allies. So the former minister of information communication, the
immediate former minister, Joseph Mushero created the network with me.
And it was -- it is what it is now. Chk.
And as a woman and I knew how difficult it is, especially for young
women to get into this kind of leadership position, so I only stayed
long enough to be able to pave the way and hand it over to the current
convener, Grace Kethiger, and I remember making her promise me that she
will not continue being a convener for more than five years so she can
hand over to the next women so we can have even more women in this
space.
So I moved from there and worked with the African Union for about
three years. That was I think the most difficult period of miff life
because I became the punching bag. I was an easy target. I became the
punching bag for our top level domain, dot Africa. We were fighting
for our top level domain, dot Africa from an American that wanted it.
So an American wanting -- I don't know the name -- that belongs to an
entire continent. How I became a punching bag was because I was the
only woman among the team of men that was fighting for that.
We eventually had the -- the domain name delegated to African Union
with a back hand manager, and I'm really proud of that.
Moved from then and I am now leading and worked for Mozilla for about
two years as the policy lead for Africa and I'm now leading a programme
that's looking at having Mozilla's presence in the global majority. So
in Africa, South America, and Asia.
Because Mozilla is an American company that hasn't actually made
such -- you know, a huge effort to be global. So my role is actually
to create a blueprint from Mozilla to show up globally and to show up
globally different because Mozilla is not big tech, its a he a mission
base the company although I work for the corporation, not for the
foundation but we are a very different kind of corporation. We believe
in an Internet that is truly healthy, joyful, and puts people
especially women, back in control of their online lives.
I'll leave it at that for any -- for any questions.
Back to you, Towela. Thank you.
>> TOWELA NYIRENDA-JERE: Thank you very much. And I think maybe
with themes of persistence, resilience and being able to pave the way
and hand over and pass the baton to other women I think are coming
through in terms of your tore story. I'm going to turn to you Bonnita
Nyamwire, and I know you've done a lot of research in terms of looking
at issues around women, but especially the Internet. You have caused a
very interesting report about all mat realities and all mat Internet
and how African feminist research can guide a feminist Internet. I'm
curious to know a little more about this research and really what were
the most interesting insights that you were able to uncover. Bonnita.
You can see me --
>> BONNITA NYAMWIRE: You can see me and hear me, please let me know.
My name is Bonnita as already introduced I work for policy as
co-director in research. And the research that was talking about, we
conducted as policy in 2019, 2020. That was in five African countries.
Uganda, Kenya, South Africa, Senegal, and Ethiopia. And in this
research we looked at experiences of women who use the Internet. So
general women who use the Internet and what it -- wanted to understand
their experiences, gain an insight into their experiences, while using
online spaces, while using the Internet and we got a very
interesting -- what you can say interesting findings, but also very sad
findings on the side of women.
And most -- some of the key findings that we got were that all women
are generally affected by online harassment, you know. In online
spaces, and different platforms. And it is not that only women
affected, even men are also affected by online harassment or online
gender-based violence. But women are significantly affected. They are
more affected compared to men. And we also discovered that it was
different categories of women that are affected by this online
harassment in these digital spaces. There were categories that were
more affected than the others. And we looked at -- we saw women who
are in positions of leadership. Like Alice was saying, she was, you
know, a punching bag. Very, very true.
I relate with her experience, physically but also online when it
comes to women who are in leadership positions, both politically and --
positions, they are very significantly affected by online harassment,
then women human rights defenders. Again, goes back to Alice's job at
one point as a woman, human rights defender. They are also
significantly affected by online harassment because of the work they
do. They are trying to create separate spaces for other women and
girls. So they really become punching bags in online spaces, but also
in offline spaces like Alice really said.
Then women in the media.
Women journalists, bloggers, influencers because of the work they do.
They are in the face of the TV, of online platforms. Every time
sharing news, raising awareness on different issues. So they also
significantly face or experience online harassment. So those were the
key categories of women that we found that had significantly affected
by online harassment. Then the other key finding from our research was
that issues of online presence for African women and not as well
attended to if you compare to other forms of violence. And this is
about online gender based violence. So we found that other forms of
harassment or violence or gender based violence, they are well attended
to, they are articulated. They are policies which are very straight
forward. But if you look at online harassment, online gender based
violence, it is not as well as explored if you compare with for
instance domestic violence, with intimate partner violence, with female
genital mutilation. I will give an example for instance if you come to
Uganda to any police station, looking for just that or recorded cases
of online gender based violence, you will hardly find any. But you
find cases of domestic violence have been recorded. Cases of Internet
partner violence have been recorded. FGM is very recorded in areas
where it was in Uganda, or is still even after today.
So you find that these issues of online gender based violence among
women, they are not as recorded as if you compare with other cases
of -- or forms of violence against women. So which is a very, very
big -- actually tend to be pushed away and they are told that oh, this
is a small thing that you can deal with. You can handle that. It's
very simple. Or you actually -- you are -- who posted it one, handle
it. And they made -- it is because of the work they do, it is because
of their presence on line spaces, in digital spaces that they encounter
these experiences. That was the other issue that we found out. The
other one was that what we see offline actually is reproduced online.
You know.
Discriminatory gender practices shift by social, economic, cultural
and political structures that we see offline. They are really now
reproduced online. You know. Whatever women are encountering in --
offline spaces they are now seeing the same thing happening to them in
online spaces. On social media platforms and so on and so forth.
The other key finding was that the policies that exist for countering
online gender based violence among women, they are not very explicit
about this kind of violence. They are very sided. They talk about
cyber security, they talk about discrimination, you know, in online
spaces. They are -- there should be discrimination, there should be
equality. The Internet is a human right, even for women. But they are
not very explicit -- they don't really come out to say online
harassment. They don't really -- against women. Because we have had
policies, you know, like domestic violence, intimate partner violence,
saying A, B, C, D, X, Y, Z, about women, about girls, about children.
So that is not yet happening in the context of online gender-based
violence. Most of the policies -- again from the -- you know. They
talk about, you know, gender equality. But they do not really come out
about this form of violence. So those are some of the key findings
that we established from our research. And I will leave it at that.
Thank you very much.
>> TOWELA NYIRENDA-JERE: Thank you, Bonnita. And really thank you
for highlighting I think the fact that perhaps there's a lot of
asymmetry in terms of the information that is being captured about
women's experiences online, especially when it pertains to the harm
that is caused about I online spaces and how that perhaps can then
impact on the women, the ability to engage effectively with online
spaces. I think it was important maybe as we -- we're having this
discussion to always be mindful that you know, in our context I think
women stand a very broad socioeconomic base. So you have women in the
rural areas, you have women in the urban, peri urban and all these
women are have different experiences with the same issues. And the
question becomes how does one come to address that as well.
I'm going to turn to you now Nnenna, I know you are a prolific
academic and researcher. You teach on law and technology in the U.K.
but you're also very connected to the policy spaces not only globally
but on the continent as well.
And you have a leading role in the AU cyber expert group. I'm
curious to hear from you, what are your experiences been as a woman
working in this field. But working I think in two different contexts,
one in the U.K. one here on the continent. And really trying to
navigate that space in terms of the intersection of law and technology,
but also your journey as a woman in that space.
>> NNENNNA IFEANYI-AJUFO: Thank you so much, Towela. I'll say thank
you so much for this very important conversation, this panel. And of
course to GIZ as well. In terms of personal experience, I would say
that a huge motivation for me has been women's rights. 17, 1 years
ago -- which is also interesting to see the dimensions, the different
dimensions of our conversation in terms of women and the discussion.
I was researching into criminal human rights abuses, international
criminal crimes, in Africa -- about 18 years ago. And it struck me one
day how women's voices could be amplified in terms of being witnesses
or being victims and interestingly the years later the international
criminal court is now accepting digital evidence. And for me at that
time it was how do I work in an area where digital evidence, human
rights, cyber rights would be relevant. And I think as we have these
conversations there are three key issues that needs to be underscored.
The first one is you know, human rights and technology for women which
Bonnita has talked a lot about, digital rights. There are also
questions of cyber security and women. Which Bonnita has also
highlighted. And also bridging the digital divide is key in Africa.
Because sometimes when I think about bridging the digital divide in
Africa there are still levels to it. Which Africa remains the least
digitalized renal I don't know in the world. But not just bridging the
gender divide as we talk about but also enhancing inclusion and
ownership in the digital space for women.
These conversations need to be had, to be had in this sort of -- when
we promote these discussions. In terms of my experience and you know
aligning to promoting women, and enhancing women's participation and
rights for women. I will first of all start by saying that in the
policy space I will come to the research and academic perspective. In
the policy space there is very little focus and targeted policy
implementation and even policy development for women in Africa.
What we have seen is sort of a charity approach to these
conversations. Sometimes I usually say it's easy to come for election
campaigns and hear men talk about what they will do for women. And of
course that is also reflected in the digital space. So it's easy for
new policy-makers to talk about what they want to do for women, but in
reality, these policies are not clearly conceptually clear. And they
are not even -- there is no plan to implement these policies.
The other issue is a lack of harmonized approach to these issues.
Now, one of the things we pointed out as being in the U.K. you would
see a more honour Mondayized approach to these issues. It is clear
that this is what the policy is all about, this is what the target,
this is what the outcome, this is what the goal is. In Africa there is
no homogenized approach, whether from the Africa Kahn union regional
level, subregional level and even at the national level. So even at
the national level you have this sort of fragment approach to the
issues of women, in the digital space.
Whether it's for inclusion, whether it's for participation. Digital
empowerment, cyber security issues, or questions of digital rights.
What you then have is a more individualistic approach in terms of the
capacity building, in early its of access. You have individuals who
want to help, you have civil society organisation like Bonnita's
organizations. But then when you then talk of having it harmonized and
measuring the implementation, is usually a challenge.
The other issue for me is Africa's digital transformation strategy p
strategy. I mean we've done well by pushing out digital transformation
and strategy for the next ten years, but I usually ask where is the
accountability in terms of the digital transfers administration
strategy? Are we clear and what we want to achieve with the digital
transformation strategy (?) What is the short term implementation, the
long term implementation. It has been there for three or for years
now, where are the gains, we don't see any documents telling us this is
what has been achieved. Who has achieved what. We have to be
practical with these different conversations. It is very silent when
you talk of women. There is even a lack of prioritization of these
issues, that is where we need to start sag the conversation. Are we
prioritizing issues offend he ever. And when we talk of gender in
Africa we usually think oh, it's all about empowering women. It's just
about women. But it's a whole triangle of even empowering children,
girls, the girl child, children. And even the family as a whole. And
if you look at Africa's charter on human rights, Africa is one
continent that actually stipulates culture and family as a key issue.
And I think it's something that should be reflected in other aspect.
Now I also want to talk about research. I think in 2017 I was
privileged to do a human rights publication on human rights and
technology for African women. Sometimes I go back to look for research
in relation to women in Africa. There is none. Interestingly I'm
working with Bonnita on a detailed probably jekt on cyber rights. It's
been a struggle getting back -- that book published. She knows about
this. And it just gets me to reflect on the challenges you have with
research. First of all U all the challenge of having avr Kahn
researchers in the field. We can't do anything with our data, we can't
do anything without research. One thing I've noticed in terms of my
experience is a huge challenge in that aspect. We can't have these
conversations if we have not mapped the realities, I know ICT has been
trying to do so much work as well. So we can't have these
conversations if we've not mapped the reality. It becomes more
hypothetical than it is real, saying Africa in terms of culture, gender
issues, but then in reality, if we can't map the reality, we can't
actually answer or have a valid conversation with these issues. As we
go on I can talk more about other experiences. Thank you.
>> TOWELA NYIRENDA-JERE: Thank you very much, Nnenna, I will not
attempt summarize all of that. Number one we don't want charity. We
don't want tokenism. Women want to be adequately included in all
aspects of whether it's policy making, policy implementation, research.
And just making sure that our voices are heard. And I think that to
the point around really the research and the data and the evidence, I
think there is also I think a space perhaps for having a conversation
about how as women we're going to show up in terms of leading and
driving some of these processes. Including holding our institutions to
account. When they develop strategies and when these strategies now
need to be implemented.
So Tobias, I'm going to now turn to you. If you have heard from
three very powerful women. One more still to come.
But I'm curious to know from you now in the role that you have,
working at GIZ, working with the African Union and really managing that
cooperation between the GIZ, on behalf of the German government and
African Union. Based on your experience how do you see Germany's
developing cooperation adequately supporting Africa's digital
transformation and what role do you see gender inclusiveness playing in
the digital sector? Tobias?
>> Tobias. Okay. I try this one. Yeah. Thank you so much Towela
and good afternoon to everyone and good morning to those who are
joining us online from the African continent. It's a real pleasure to
be here at the IGF and I would just like to use the -- seize the
opportunity to thank our hosts, the government and people of Japan for
doing an absolutely wonderful job at the hospitality here in Kyoto.
Since I identify as a feminist and ally in the cause of women's
empowerment, it's of course a particular honour to be on a panel that
is basically -- except for myself, only staffed with powerful and
inspiring women. And I believe that this actually sends also an
important signal because I think we all know that there is tendency in
international conferences for panels to be rather male-dominated.
The theme of this session is actually a very important one for the
jer manl development corporation. I mean a feminist approach to
Africa's digital transformation, it both resonates with the German
development corporation as a whole in terms of general policy but also
especially with the work that my colleagues and I are doing in the
context of our work with the African Union.
So as you might know, the German government has made gender equality
a key priority and that includes also having a foreign and
development -- foreign and development policy that takes gender
equality as a particular priority.
So the German federal ministry of economic corporation, the TNZ,
recently introduced a new strategic approach which it calls the
feminist development policy. And at the core of that policy or
strategy lie the three Rs. A focus on rights, resources, and
representation. And sort of three important dimensions that we need to
consider when promoting the cause of women's empowerment. In that
spirit Germany hats set itself the goal of dedicating directly 90
percent of the resources of the German development corporation put
forward globally to contribute to gender equality by 2025. And this
feminist agenda is of course also a close guiding principle for our
cooperation with the African Union including AUDA Napat, where Towela
works and together in that context we aim to eliminate discriminatory
structures for women and girls and other marginalized groups in the
field of digitalalization and data governance. And in this context we
try to ensure particularly that female voices are systematically
considered in all of the activities of the German development
corporation portfolio and not only that these voices are included, but
also that they're actually heard and find the right resonance.
And the reason why we do this is out of the conviction, the
fundamental conviction that sustainable development cannot be achieved
if we don't address the fundamental flaws and inequalities in power
structures. And this includes women particularly, constitute 50
percent of the population of this planet. But it of course also
includes any other group that experiences any form of discrimination
based on any of the criteria, or characteristics.
So and in that sense it's particularly important that gender equality
and inclusion become reality for all. Thank you.
>> TOWELA NYIRENDA-JERE: Thank you for that, thank you for the
rights, resources, representation. I don't know about anybody else but
I have latched on to that 90 percent. We will see how we also make
sure that we're able to direct resources adequately towards the
participation of women. But I think it's also perhaps a challenge
between the continent as well in terms of being able to also direct
more resources to amplifying the voitss of women.
My last panelist I believe Liz is not in the room. Before we go to
taking some Q&A and comments from the room and from those online. Liz
I'm going to invite you to really share with us your experience in
terms of the work that you've been doing and Internet governance, in
multistakeholder engagement in Africa and really perhaps just getting
to hear from you your experience of the gaps in terms of where, you
know, women's engagement in digital processes is evident. And then
also what else you have found in terms of your work both at Ria, as
well as at kicker net. Liz.
>> Thank you. Thank you JZ for inviting me to this session which I'm
so passionate about. I'd like to start off by saying my story is not a
movie like Alice, Alice Munoz chls and the rest. Because she actually
opened up with for us other women who are coming after her.
And myself -- actually my story started out from the global Internet
governance that she organised in Kenya in 20 -- was it 2012? 2011.
Then I was a student and I was struggling to find out where I would fit
in. Into the society as a second year student, taking communications,
bachelor education, communications. At that time I was struggling to
see whether I would like to be a poet, I would like to be a singer, I
would like to be all those things.
But then I stumbled upon -- I noticed that or said something like do
you want to know how the Internet works? And I studied -- started
volunteering for that organisation.
But what I didn't know is that I was working on the wrong side of the
history. So when Alice -- when Alice says that she was being bullied,
I was on the team that was bullying her. I wasn't bullying, but...
(Laughter)
>> LIZ OTEMBO: But was on that side. Until I was invited to the
global IGF, to market the other side of Deutsche Africa and I got the
story and I was invited to intern at Kenya Qeshuls, a board member.
Also good experience from that leadership and from there I got to have
a chance to -- to be in the team that actually formed Internet society
Kenya chapter. Chk which was a struggle to form because of many -- a
lot of political issues. Through the ten years. But it was a success.
I'd like to say that at that -- during that year tech was really
developing in Kenya. But it was so much of an elitist thing. And a
men's thing. So being in that field as a woman it was intimidating and
I would agree it's also violent. Because you raise your hand, no one
is interested to get what you're saying. And even when you manage to
say something, no one acknowledges it. And it's those -- those tiny
things that actually discourage you from continue being in the space.
At that time as a woman and as a youth the spaces to participate in
Internet governance was very, very little.
And it was a struggle to stay in the space. Because one, you need
to -- to sustain yourself in the space you need to travel, you need to
contribute, as a volunteer. It meant that at that time you're
struggling between finding a job that actually pays you and actually
doing some of these passionate things.
And also when you are attending meetings, as a young woman you are
assign the the role of a note taker. And you don't get to contribute
to those meetings. Chk so for a very long time I was a note taker but
it wasn't a disadvantage. Waept a disadvantage in the end because you
get to understand -- because the field is so dynamic. It meant that
you get to understand what people are saying. You have to put down in
a way that other people also understand what is communicated in those
meetings.
And actually that helps grow my -- my career.
So from that when dij yo was taking over kicker net she invited me to
be part of the board members of kicker net. I would say our experience
there was exciting and challenging at the same time. Because that was
when Internet governance and the usage of Internet was really opening
up in Kenya.
And (exciting) we had to start demystifying concepts of net
neutrality previously in a way that policy-makers actually understand.
And I think that was the most exciting thing for me here during that
time. And I remember -- now moving it forward to now when -- were
trying to tell people about the process of privacy. And data
protection. Now it's very, very easy. I remember the first times when
we were advocating for the same and trying to get Parliament to put in
data protection policy. Parliamentarians would ask if you're a good
citizen, what do you want to hide? And what would a good citizen want
to hide? And those are very difficult questions also to answer from
our end. And so conceptualizing those concepts in a way that
policy-makers and even the people on the ground got to understand and
even start working on those policies was a challenging thing. But it
was also exciting at the same time.
So I continued working with kicker net. And I think as Alice
mentions, that we moved from -- so that space of engagement is still an
engagement space, but you also realise that much of the things that are
being said on the list, but not being carried out or even being
followed up. So I'm -- government made a commitment to say that they
want to follow up with data protection frameworks, then they would need
someone to help them. The civil society to help them. And kicker net
became that civil society that actually helped them through policy
implementation. That meant that we had to be registered, that meant
that we had to stafrt designing the organisation from just where people
just engaged but also people collaborated at the back end.
So after kicker net I moved to global cyber security capacity centre
which was another exciting venture for me. I felt like I had done
enough at the national level and we had opened up spaces for
participation through the Kenya school of Internet governance that
brought in very many experts from different fields to stafrt working on
Internet governance issues. Which Kecker net by itself could not have
done that because it was so violent even for for the organisation. So
at the GSEC, another exciting work like I said and I worked with
Towela, at that time I also started working with Riya, because there
were very big partners with the GCSEC form ring, the global siebl cyber
security, capacity centre for Africa, CTSA. And that's where we worked
with governments to actually build capacity. National capacity. On
cyber security.
There again it was a model space -- another space where women were
not actively participate. And especially African women and they
started driving the concept of cyber security not just being a
technical thing but it's also -- it was a people process and women were
so instrumental in participating in cyber security policies. One also
because there are -- there are also most vulnerable because digital
literacy on the other side of digital -- the disparate on digital
literacy, access use, the major of the -- domestic nature of African
homes is that women manage the small bills in homes. And the ones who
use the mobile money, they're the ones who manage the homes.
So even being targeted by what we call them -- the social engineering
tactics was very easy. Like someone being told that your child is
sick, please send this kind of money or they're in danger. And there
would be vulnerable too from that point.
So we -- with those projects we started seeing the need of getting
more women into the space of cyber security capacity. We started -- we
partnered with ITU, we partnered with some of the universities that
were working on -- Universities in Cape Town, in Tanzania, in global
cyber -- capacity building, CC B for women. And from there I see more
women participating, they're lumized in those programmes, participating
actually.
So I worked at the GCSEC for like one or two drn one and a half to
two years. And then I felt like I wanted develop my research capacity.
And I moved to Riyadh. And the first project with Riyadh was
conceptualizing the feminist principles that would go into the GDC.
What the new deal that we want. That is -- resonated so much with me
because through my work I have seen how women have been affected. This
pro -- disproportionately by ICT. They lack access, lack of
representation, with the new technologies, they become even more
marginalized because they're into the seen in the new technologies like
AI, which also automatically makes decisions for them.
So these decisions are blieasked even in the first place.
And from there we started developing not just feminist principles but
African perspectives. To which epter these global processes that are
actually starting. Which we are continuing to make submissions, to
engage with the technical envoy with other partners on this feminist
principles.
In every submissions that you also make, we also try to see the
gender perspective of it. And from the access research, I think this
is something that you've been seeing through the IGF. The inequalities
that -- that are actually reflected from the after access salaries,
that even are so much disproportionately affected in such a way that
there's so much economic -- for them to participate economically,
politically and even socially.
And what the access survey does is to provide this subjugated data so
that you can see the realities of access and how they are affected even
beyond.
I'm going to stop here and then I'll work on any questions if you
have.
>> TOWELA NYIRENDA-JERE: Thank you very much. I commend my panel
because I think you have made our work a little easier because you have
managed to touch on a number of things, interventions, from looking at
your experiences, and what the barriers. And maybe even some of the
opportunity.
So what I would like to do now -- because I am mindful of time and I
also would like to give space for discussion and dialogue and Q&A, so
I'm going to open the floor now for questions, comments, input. Both
from the online and those that are physically in the room. And for
this I am going to hand over to you Alice, to manage for us this
process and Fabiola, I think we are support online interventions.
>> ALICE MUNYUA: Thank you to all the other panelists. I'd like to
open it up to any questions.
From the room.
The microphones, one there, one there.
And also roving microphones here.
This one's -- this passage.
>> I want only to say what I told her many years ago. She looked at
me in one of these -- one of these meetings and said to me -- because I
offered and put up my hand to take notes. And she said you never do
that.
But actually as -- as someone said, I don't know who was it, was it
you Liz, someone said if you take notes, it does give you a certain
kind of power as well.
>> Yes, it does.
>> I just wanted to say that I think -- I mean, it's really amazing
to listen to the stories. And Alice said movies is a good idea. Liz
is right there. My name is Anut swornson and together with African
Union and organise the Internet African school on Internet governance
each year. One thing I can say to that is we've made huge progress.
We never struggle to get good women who are experts. Towela is one of
the founders of the school. She's very difficult to get hold of.
She's so busy. There are women in the field. We have been on this
panel here. And there are others.
And so the expertise is there. We always have at least half the
participants also women. But there are still -- they still resistance.
I think there's still particular -- they sort of assumptions. There's
assumptions that women experts have to deal with women's issues. And
that if women were gender issues are on the agenda, it has to be a
woman that put them on the agenda. And I think at the level of
cultural norms of expectations, of how women behave, there are still
huge barriers. You know, I think at -- several of you mentioned the
bullying, the expectation of how to behave as a woman in the space.
And you're not supposed to be controversial. You're not supposed to
really be challenging. Particularly not challenging people in
authority i-think in Africa respect is very much a part of the culture
of how we work. And I think it can sometimes be a little bit of a
barrier.
But I think -- I mean what we try to do with the African school is at
least create a space where there is -- where gender a recognized even
if that's not the focus. And where participants are made conscious of
the need to be respectful and to listen to one another.
So I think as one of our members of -- parl lay, when they wanted to
participate in this year's school, when they wanted the women staff
members to type their notes, she said no. And in a way that's how we
are trying to contribute to establish more sensitivity to that.
But I just want to commend you. Really. I was listening to you
and -- talk of those early years with minister Tuwja, hopefully how
many challenges there were. And I really think there has been a
substantial change. There's still lots of challenges, but compared to
the early 2000s, I think there's just -- there is more recognition,
there is more space for women to be in this space. And I think it's
done by people like yourselves. And Allison over there as well. Who
never stops annoying government officials and policy-makers with all
her very disturbing statistics.
>> FABIOLA FRICK: Thank you Andrea.
>> AUDIENCE MEMBER: Thank you Alice, for moderating this and thank
you for weathering everything that you went through. And it is
absolutely wonderful.
I am a woman. You will be surprised because on my right side is a
woman. I know my left side is a man. So together if you take the word
woman, you put a bracket on -- at the man, so you find the set is a
woman. And a man in a subset. So I am a subset of a woman.
My mother didn't go to school. And it is because of a man. His
brother, when she passed to go to the grade 4, she was told that you
cannot go to school because you are supposed to be working doing the
fields and taking care of the cows.
So when my mother told me that story, I made up my mind then when I
was in permanent school that when I grow up, you know, if I have a boy
and -- and a girl, they will grow on equal footing.
So thank you for everything.
So my thing really is to say that we really need to make sure that we
continue to support girls and boys to grow up together, to work
together. Support each other. So that as they grow up to become full
women and men, they defend each other in terms of supporting each
other. That is all I wanted to say. Thank you.
>> FABIOLA FRICK: Thank you for being an ally. Sorry, I had --
>> AUDIENCE MEMBER: I had my hand up. I'm behind you. Hello.
>> I'm so sorry.
>> AUDIENCE MEMBER: It's okay. Can I ask -- thank you. Sorry. So
my name is Tigus, I am from APC. So now everyone is looking at -- so
I'm just scared.
I been following the conversation actually online because I was
supporting a friend who was in need of some consulting. But thank you
for sending me the link. So I have listeneded to most of the
conversation. It has been very engaging. And so inspiring to hear
feminist researchers having a conversation around -- because I think we
are stuck with gender as part of analysis but not feminism being
welcome in spaces. So it's a good and refreshing thing to hear.
I have a couple of questions. Maybe if -- if the panelists can
respond to. The first one is I mean in this IGF one of the things that
we have realised it thanks to organizations like APC, after decades of
struggle that we now get to see online gender based violence with its
terminology, technology, to gender based violence being part of the
agenda. You hear it everywhere, everyone is picking it up. Which is
awesome. It's part of the struggle has been won. So that's a good
thing.
But now for me, my question is it seems like in terms of -- this
comes from a research perspective. It seems that we are much move
inclined into talking about online harassment -- which are really
valued -- valid conversations need to be having. And doxxing and --
there are other predictable thematic areas that we keep on picking up
on. And I feel like it has to be a ways in which feminists have to
start thinking about expanding the idea of violence, specifically
online from a multiple perspective. And I think I kind of came to that
realisation after we have experienced it. I'm also from Ethiopia, a
war in different regions. The online space being a prop began ta-dah
space for ripe for against women. And that being seen not only from a
government perspective but even from international media who have been
recurring around that. I think that kind of recoding -- that kind of
work needs to resurface in the space so the urgency of the matter can
be much more pertinent. So that's my invitation. And also I would
like to ask for people to start thinking about expanding the idea of
online gender based violence for multiple spaces.
The other one is how feminist is our work. I think I'm asking that
because we tend to write feminism but we end up doing a gender
analysis. For me they are two different things because feminism has
its own values in prioritizing women in gender based communities and
that sense how do you reflect about this picture that we are working on
and how are you dealing with trying to bring in feminist issues in that
space by dealing with those who are only interested in the and national
sis of it.
The last question I have is also how do you deal with chk -- this is
also again from a research perspective. One of my crit teaks that I
have in this kind 6 # gender based violence we tend to categorize women
and LGBTQ violence together. Even in the conversation that being about
women. How do feminists stafrt making sure that they -- the
eligibility community are not just there as a list but also as an act
of allies and act of contribute he shalls of knowledge. I'm asking
that question. Thank you.
Chk.
>> FABIOLA FRICK: Thank you for those questions. Would any of the
panelists -- because these are research questions. Can I hand that to
Nnenna and to Liz. Do you want to respond?
Nnenna please. Nnenna can start. Is Nnenna still online?
>> NNENNNA IFEANYI-AJUFO: Yes, I'm here. Thank you very much and I
think it's also a very important question for Bonnita. She hats also
been engaged in research. Just to say that to these points they're
very, very valid. One of the things, the project that I talked about,
the project that we're struggling to work on, I think Chapter 2 of that
book is entirely on the topic I've termed after fro cyber feminism.
Intrusting the -- you're talking about these points. I agree with you
sometimes it seems like the conversation is all about just cyber
harassment. But I also want to point out that there are also other
aspects of the -- it's a broad discourse more than -- in fact when
Towela was talking, apart from rural women there's also questions of
refugees, women who are refugees in Africa nobody is really talking
about this group in terms of access, in terms of rights. There are
absolutely so many discussions that need to be had.
But I just want to say that except we work together, I've been very
careful not to talk about personal experience because if I do, people
in the room or people online would actually pinpoint at maybe who I'm
referring to in terms of sochl of the conversations and the challenges
that we tend to have.
One of the things also pointed out too is we've moefed from the space
of technical expertise to broader aspect, policy and all of that. And
I'm excited to see that Allison is in the room. I think we need to
work more together and bring together the stories, the stories I've
heard today, gives a reflection of the research perspectives we need to
put out here. But what challenges tend to have like I said earlier is
lack of researchers, there are home grown. Again, I had the cybercrime
group of the GFCE. There is also the challenge of the global north and
Global South dichotomy which you find reflected in issues of research.
Talking of LGBTQ. We have to look at the African realities and
acceptance of these issues and advocacy and continue to push these
conversations. The fact there are people in those groups who also want
to tell their stories because of the African reality to these
perspectives they can't come out to speak about their realities. There
is that goebl south global north dichotomy. I wish we could move from
having a confer Kahn conversation to more of a Global South where we
can look at challenges, and look al commonalities in both regions, it
would help if you look at for example Latin America and this after froe
cyber feminism conversations and even from the LGBTQ perspective.
There is a lot to share.
So finally, just because of time, there are bodies for example like
the UNECA, I know they're happy to work with organizations like I know
research ICT is doing a lot. I think that it should be more platforms
for research. People want to write, I know more and more academics in
Africa they want to write but you also have this sort of westernized
approach to writing. Most people who are writing about Africa are
actually not in Africa. And that's a huge challenge. People tell you
that publishers don't actually want to work with them because they
can't validate your authenticity of the research coming from some of
the universities in Africa. I find that off putting, it's triggering
for me. You find people want to tell your stories more than you can
actually tell your story. I think the ent net is here -- the Internet
governance school, a great agenda. It would be an opportunity to
highlight more of these issues as well as give opportunities for more
platforms for women to talk about these issues from the points you've
raised. Thank you.
>> ALICE MUNYUA: Thank you Nnenna for that. Thank you for bringing
up the global dichotomy. More nuanced than that. When you look at
feminism there's the way Black women look at feminism and the way of
the nonBlack women look at feminism. That dichotomy that I think we
should not shy away from talking about it.
It should not -- you know it's a controversial issue, we should not
leave.
Yeah. Liz, and then there's a lady --
>> Liz there's --
>> ALICE MUNYUA: I can give you this one.
Okay. I can take it out. To Liz.
Liz.
>> Tobias. Let's -- here take this one.
>> LIZ OTEMBO: Is this one working? Thank you. I gathered that
total as was the -- of feminism as its in different regions, which
actually started talking about. And this is something that you realise
not just in my walk with Riya, also with kicker net. Some of these
concepts come from the global north because the funding is also coming
from the global north. It comes with the conceptualization of how the
global north faces it. And when you come to the ground, you realise
that there's a disconnect. That people don't really under -- don't
understand what you're saying or they just listen to you but there's no
impacts that is actually going to happen.
The other kinds of differences in these terminologies is how also
different features in Africa conceptualize the term. Because it's
different from sang phone region, East African region, South African
region. What you're trying to do at research Ied T Africa is map some
of these conceptualizations when you're talking to policy-makers, what
are we equipping them with? Are we equipping them with evidence from
what we get from the ground?
And also with our consultation we also try to reach as wide as we can
so that we also get the contributions from especially from Franco phone
which is not really covered in the work that we do.
So yeah, the other one was on cyber harassment. And rights. Which
is also kind of the same. Most of the work that organizations in
Africa and women do first go to cyber harassment, rights, women
accessing opportunities. And it is rightly so because we look at these
things as just one theme. But it's one theme that is actually
affecting other areas of women participation. Be it in business
participation, because so much businesses are going online. So much
marketing is actually going online. And when women can't participate
in these social spaces, it means that they can't market themselves.
They can't even run for office.
There's this training that we actually did after Kenyan elections,
where we called women who ride and started getting their experiences on
how they performed and whether they would like to vie again. And they
were so discouraged because of the general -- that they have -- journey
they've gone through. So it's a series of harassment, one after
another and through the campaign period think think this is the last
one until we go to vote. And then after voting, they even realise that
even the promises that they got from the ground, nothing -- nothing
just actually materialized. So they think back and they're like all
these hurdles that they pass through including cyber harassment, was it
worth it when it doesn't actually translate to a single vote?
So when we do -- when you actually did that training, and it was a
whole assumption, not just cyber security training but also for them
how to engage themselves, much of it covered with the literacy and
digital literacy. You start getting hope. And different approaches in
how they also engage the society.
So coming back to the terminologies and how they help how to
translate on the ground, it's that some of these approaches we have to
be careful in how we translate them from the West. Coming down.
Because it means that these trainings that we do, as much as we get
funding from them, one, they're not having an impact and true they're
even doing worse because they go out there with so much confidence, but
yet they get even more backlash. When it comes to -- it comes to
implementation.
I think the first date of security trainings we emphasize on women
having a thick skin. Which really didn't help. And we tried to
conceptualize things like how should we take on our content online.
Should we go with the norms that are actually there? If a woman is
supposed to market themselves with how they dress, should they continue
or should they continue with engaging with content?
And they started mapping out how much of these women or -- giving
examples of women politicians, especially who actually engage online
with political deologies rather than other types of content that are
quite popular.
And when telling their realities that there are women who are out
there that don't actually conform to these content that are popular and
are actually attract so much cyber bullying and cyber violence and they
can actually engage in ideologies they start seeing these examples as
things that can actually work and they've actually started trying them
out.
Chk so yeah, in conclusion I think -- yeah, this -- we can form our
own ideologies of how that would look like. And how -- what approaches
that you can use in engaging. When seeking higher positions, political
positions, or whatever social positions that you want.
>> Thank you everyone. So my first response -- not a question, just
supplementing the conversation. Asked a question that are you
equipping policy-makers with evidence. And that is my thought process
this whole time. Which takes me back to a time last year when I was
invited as a note taker for a consultation meeting where our -- my name
is Claire. I'm from Uganda. Ministry of information and technology
was trying to introduce a bill that is going to review policies and
laws governing the media industry in Uganda and holding consultation
meetings. This particular consultation meeting was this big. With
just one woman. Two women. Another lady and myself was taking notes.
So I listened to the conversation and the views that everyone in the
room had and did my job as a note taker. When I was done with my
report, what I did was to write my own recommendations as a note taker.
But okay, this is what was discussed. But I think that we can do
better to get more diverse views and I wrote about three pages of
recommendations at the end. And then included the list of women, what
we do and how they can contribute to this discussion. And I also
included evidence, one of the rofrts that I test was the report, the
policy that Bonnita has been working on that talks about cyber
harassment and stuff.
And other reports I have talked about issues affecting women in the
media industry in Uganda. So I test that to the report and included a
note in the email to the person who decided -- he's the report, didn't
participate in the discussion because I had to listen to your views,
but I also added my views as a woman who's going to a meeting in the
industry and is affected by this issues. I've also included
recommendations of women you can invite in future.
Within a month or so there was another activity that was involving
the women that had listed. So I think sometimes you have to use the
little opportunity you have to make your mark. Thank you.
>> TOBIAS: Yes, thank you. I just wanted from the perspective of a
policy maker and the German development corporation address some of the
things that have been said here first of all I very much agree with my
co-panelists that labels are something that is quite difficult and we
have different conceptualizations between what feminism means between
the global north and Global South. It is also something even if I look
at my own country, Germany you will find a huge diversity of different
feminist perspectives and streams and I think what is important is not
to lose the final end out of sight, which is that I mean certainly are
differences, but I think quite often the issues that we're facing are
quite basic. And there are -- there's a lot of common ground, there
are a lot of interfaces between different diverging opinions that we
share together.
And I think if we want to achieve something jointly, I think we
should focus on that rather than dwelling on or having conceptual
debates about which label is the right one.
The second point that I think concerns us as policy-makers a lot is
also the question of how we translate what we observe, with a we see
into practice. Because we -- I mean, we are always interested in
improving the development interventions that we do. And I think it's
very important to have discussions like this. And rely on the findings
of research to actually have evidence-based interventions. And I think
we often find that we're still lacking a lot of detail, knowledge, of
what other specific obstacles that women face in terms of access to
digital services, for example.
On one hand. So what's the diagnosis of what is -- what are the
issues? And on the other hand what are effective ways, even if we know
them, how to address them, because we often work also in highly complex
multistakeholder policy envinements where there are power structures
ingrained and infomal structures in ministries and organizations. So
even having just the diagnosis is not enough to really design effective
interventions.
And I think that's why the discussions like this are very important.
>> My name is Tashi, I'm from India. It's been a very fascinating
discussion because although I'm not from the region, I have worked in
the region in some way or the other. And I like how everyone talks
about policy, people talk about regulation.
My question was I was actually looking at what are some of the best
practices and solutions that organizations have when it comes to
convincing women to come forward and report a complaint.
And also -- and complaint of an abuse or harm.
I used to work on building multilingual repository of hate speech
lexicons. Policy -- people were talking -- someone was here from
policy. Policy actually used a data set for a report that they did out
for online abuses against female politicians in Uganda. And I think
there's also a new report out for the tan saneian region. I'm more
interested in learning about how these discussions can help platform
accountability.
Not with big tech but maybe smaller platforms that would take chk
these mechanisms seriously. But I'm really curious as to how Mozilla
is leading that work or GSZis leading that work in keeping platforms
accountable and how do we find solutions. Because there are so many of
these mechanisms but we also see that a lot of women are not confident
with moving online and sharing their grievances or complaint. I know
I'm running out of time.
>> That would be the last question. And Tobias, do you want to start
with how TGZdeals with that. The question is some examples. And we
want -- yeah.
Okay. So -- we've only got five more minutes. At Mozilla, we're
very lucky to begin with. Mozilla was founded by a woman. (This is
Alice) we have Michelle baker, she's the chairperson and currency of
the Mozilla corporation. And actually more than nearly 90 peshs of the
executives are women. So very, very proud.
Of Mozilla.
You know, and we actually really work hard to try and engage as many
women as we can. And not just engaging them, but we go beyond. For
example understanding the role that women play in society and community
that there's still that societal expectation chths so we make space for
that kind of thing. For example parental understanding that the
parental obligations are usually, you know, harm placed on women. And
a real emphasis on engaging -- on capacity building, especially you
know for women.
We haven't got it right yet. It's still an issue. And it's still an
issue we are struggling with. Even as a mission-based company. And
really looking for to working with other organizations to be able to
find really lasting and sustainable solutions to support that.
And in fact that brings me to one issue that we've done for example
and together with the African Union and Towela we conducted the
research on the status of system and women entrepreneurs. That is one
thing we haven't touched on. The African continent, more than 80 #
percent of micro, small and medium entrepreneurs are women. And yet
they receive only zero.3. Not 2 percent of funding and BC support
across the continent.
Then when you go to the states where I live, recently I'm sure -- I
don't know how many of you had -- there was an appeal you know where a
court ordered a Black woman organisation, I can't remember what it's
called -- to pose providing funding to Black women. Claiming
discrimination, a conservative group. Yet when you look at the amount
of VCs that those Black women in the U.S. receive, 0.3 percent. You
know, so we still have a huge problem. You know, women do most of the
work and we still haven't managed to come up with solutions.
So I'll end there. I'm so sorry, I cannot accommodate any more
questions. I would like to handle over back to Towela for closing
remarks. Back to you Towela. Thank you. #.
>> TOWELA NYIRENDA-JERE: Thank you very much for the different
comments, questions and input I'm going to attempt to give us maybe
five key take-aways from this discussion.
First one I think is that we need to acknowledge and recognize the
fact that there are very many dimensions in terms of talking about
feminism and a feminist Internet. There are also very many dichotomies
that exist as we navigate that space.
Second thing I think that is important as a recommendation is that we
need to really put a lot more emphasis on experience sharing and this
experience sharing should be between the different stakeholders in the
continent, between regions on the continent, between Africa and the
Global South and of course in the Global South and the global north.
The third one I think is that we need more opportunities and spaces
to bring out the data, the evidence, the insights. We need to be able
to tell our own stories as Africans and African women. We need to
value each other. We need to value our work. And value our research.
Oftentimes we value the research that comes at us and to us from
outside the continent and I think we need to start valuizing our own
research and creating spaces where we can undertake this research but
also disseminate findings to our policy-makers and into the spaces.
The fourth one I think is capacity building that we need, need to
continue investing in capacity building. Cyber capacity building may
be more specifically. And to this point I think just to mention the
fact that there is an Africa cyber capacity building agenda that it has
been developed that will be launched later this year. And I think it
will be in -- for all of us to see how do we participate in that,
contribute to that, to make sure we are building the requisite
capacity, but again being mindful of the fact that this should not be
an elitist type of way that we work when we look at capacity building
because that capacity has to start all the way from the grassroots and
find its way in terms of making sure that we are equipping everybody
that needs to be equipped on the continent.
The last one I think is really about the accountability and really
looking at the fact that we have an over arcing framework in the AU,
digital traerj and all the frameworks emanating from that. And then
the question is how do we make sure that we are holding each other to
account. How do we make sure that issues of gender indeed are being
adequately captured and reflected as we develop all these different
frameworks, strategies and implement them.
Lastly, I think that -- so you know, going out of all of this, I
think perhaps if I recall from the Africa IGF, one of the things that
was raised is that we like to talk and we talk a lot. And then we talk
and then we leave and nothing happens. For the question for us is what
is going to happen after this.
Personally, I think -- and as myself, my commitment is really on the
digital strategy. Really making sure that when we are starting to
implement the strategy, that these issues that we are talking about
will be adequately reflected and then I'm inviting all of you also to
think, you know, what is your commitment. What is it that you are
going to do in terms of taking forward some of these things that we
have discussed today.
I will invite you to continue the discussions. For those of us
online, we will continue online for those at the IGF, please make use
of your breaks and all the other spaces to have these conversations.
And with that I want to thank my panelists, Alice, Nnenna, Bonnita,
Liz, and Tobia, and thank you for Fabiola and Katherine working in the
background and wishing you all a great day further and also an
enjoyable rest of the IGF. Thank you very much.